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Yesterday, I had an execution and when I woke up today it was reversed. I received no notification, the position and all traces of the execution were simply missing. After talking to TK, it was reversed as an erroneous trade. I'd write it off as a fluke except this isn't the first time it's happened. What's a good waiting period on TK to be sure a trade has really executed after they tell you it has executed? Luckly, I didn't do anything with this stock yesterday. The last time I sold the shares, then they reversed the buy and I ended up being short.
Waiting period as in the time between when it says "executed" on the order status screen and I actually know whether I have those shares. Either to sell or so that I can re-enter a buy order. Calling to confirm is not a viable option. They will just look at the same data you are looking at and just reinterate what you see online. When I called up to ask what happened to my shares, initially they were just as baffled as I was since there is no trace that the execution ever happened. Here's a tip. Hold on to those email execution confirmations. Instead of removing all traces of the execution, it would be far better if they just amended it's status to reversed/cancelled/invalid/whatever. An email notification to the client would also go a long way.
I think we have a misunderstanding. The shares did show up immediately in my account as well as the order status changing to "executed". The issue is whether the trade will be reversed and those shares removed later. Yesterday, the shares were in my account and the order status was "executed". My screen showed that all day. This morning when I looked, the shares were gone as well as any signs of it under activity. This is what happens at TK when the trade is backed out. It's as if it never existed. Thus the dilemna. Yesterday the trade looked good and the shares were in my account. Today, they are gone and it's exactly as if the trade never happened. If I had sold these "phantom" shares yesterday, then I would have sold short as far as TK is concerned today when they backed out the buy later. Which would have been bad since stock is up today and I would have had to cover at a loss. I'm still disappointed that I missed a gain today because my execution was reversed and I wasn't notified in a timely manner so that I could have re-entered an order yesterday to catch today's gains.
Thus what is a good waiting period before I can be sure a trade will actually stay executed at TK?
Thanks for the response Rocco. The issue was that on my order status screen, the execution price wasn't abnormal. It was what my limit order price was set at and it was in line with what the stock traded at yesterday. There was no indication at all that it would be under consideration as a bad trade. It wasn't until I called this morning that I was eventually told that it traded at an erroneously low price. Why did my order status at TK report an execution price that had no bearing to reality? It reported an execution price that seemed reasonable, thus there was no reason to suspect it.
Also, when the trade was backed out, why wasn't I notified? The representative I spoke to this morning responded that my notification was his response to my question of why I wasn't notified. So I need to call in to ask why I wasn't notified to get notification?
Once again, thanks for your response. It is truly appreciated. I do find it troubling that it's TK policy to not notify their clients of reversed trades under certain situations. This only leads to confusion when a client wonders what happened to their shares.
There are glitches on the website. Quotes in particular have not worked properly for me in quite a while. I take the quotes I get on TK with a grain of salt. I guess I'll have to apply that same skepticism to the order executions as well. I have gotten into the habit of taking screenshots when things are blatantly wrong. In this case, that didn't seem to be the case. I guess the takeaway for me from this incident is to take screenshots regularly and double check all transactions on TK.
It wasn't. It happened the day after that incident. And was not one of the 6 stocks that was reversed.
How long to wait on TK before I can be sure an execution really happened?
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Yesterday, I had an execution and when I woke up today it was reversed. I received no notification, the position and all traces of the execution were simply missing. After talking to TK, it was reversed as an erroneous trade. I'd write it off as a fluke except this isn't the first time it's happened. What's a good waiting period on TK to be sure a trade has really executed after they tell you it has executed? Luckly, I didn't do anything with this stock yesterday. The last time I sold the shares, then they reversed the buy and I ended up being short.
Define a "waiting period". I understand what you are saying, but by waiting period do you mean the time between the trade is executed and the time you call to confirm? or the time you assume it to be correct? or the time you re-trade the security? I have never had the issue you are describing.
Normally, trades show up immediately. Occasionally, there are glitches, but they are rare.
Waiting period as in the time between when it says "executed" on the order status screen and I actually know whether I have those shares. Either to sell or so that I can re-enter a buy order. Calling to confirm is not a viable option. They will just look at the same data you are looking at and just reinterate what you see online. When I called up to ask what happened to my shares, initially they were just as baffled as I was since there is no trace that the execution ever happened. Here's a tip. Hold on to those email execution confirmations. Instead of removing all traces of the execution, it would be far better if they just amended it's status to reversed/cancelled/invalid/whatever. An email notification to the client would also go a long way.
I've always noticed it immediately. And was the order not in your activity either? If that is the case then it is really odd.
I think we have a misunderstanding. The shares did show up immediately in my account as well as the order status changing to "executed". The issue is whether the trade will be reversed and those shares removed later. Yesterday, the shares were in my account and the order status was "executed". My screen showed that all day. This morning when I looked, the shares were gone as well as any signs of it under activity. This is what happens at TK when the trade is backed out. It's as if it never existed. Thus the dilemna. Yesterday the trade looked good and the shares were in my account. Today, they are gone and it's exactly as if the trade never happened. If I had sold these "phantom" shares yesterday, then I would have sold short as far as TK is concerned today when they backed out the buy later. Which would have been bad since stock is up today and I would have had to cover at a loss. I'm still disappointed that I missed a gain today because my execution was reversed and I wasn't notified in a timely manner so that I could have re-entered an order yesterday to catch today's gains.
Thus what is a good waiting period before I can be sure a trade will actually stay executed at TK?
traveltrader,
If the exchange notifies us that a fill which appears as if it could have been valid price and fill was in fact not a valid and true execution, we would attempt to reach out to affected clients immediately if at all possible. These notifications typically would occur on the trading date or within the following business day, and are rare.
If you have any further questions or concerns about the clearly erroneous execution from yesterday, you can find some information on the regulations surrounding these non-intelligible fill reports here, and we're glad to assist with any questions, concerns, or clarifications at 877-495-5464.
These are regulations that every broker-dealer and market center must comply with, and the erroneous execution reports would not have affected TradeKing alone. While we want you to feel confident in an order execution when you see it online, an instance such as this where the fill price was shown executed 96% away from the current price of the security, it would always be prudent to suspect a bad fill report, and to reach out to us to get in contact with the exchange.
Best regards,
Rocco Sabino
TradeKing
Trading and Customer Support
If the exchange notifies us that a fill which appears as if it could have been valid price and fill was in fact not a valid and true execution, we would attempt to reach out to affected clients immediately if at all possible. These notifications typically would occur on the trading date or within the following business day, and are rare.
If you have any further questions or concerns about the clearly erroneous execution from yesterday, you can find some information on the regulations surrounding these non-intelligible fill reports here, and we're glad to assist with any questions, concerns, or clarifications at 877-495-5464.
These are regulations that every broker-dealer and market center must comply with, and the erroneous execution reports would not have affected TradeKing alone. While we want you to feel confident in an order execution when you see it online, an instance such as this where the fill price was shown executed 96% away from the current price of the security, it would always be prudent to suspect a bad fill report, and to reach out to us to get in contact with the exchange.
Best regards,
Rocco Sabino
TradeKing
Trading and Customer Support
Thanks for the response Rocco. The issue was that on my order status screen, the execution price wasn't abnormal. It was what my limit order price was set at and it was in line with what the stock traded at yesterday. There was no indication at all that it would be under consideration as a bad trade. It wasn't until I called this morning that I was eventually told that it traded at an erroneously low price. Why did my order status at TK report an execution price that had no bearing to reality? It reported an execution price that seemed reasonable, thus there was no reason to suspect it.
Also, when the trade was backed out, why wasn't I notified? The representative I spoke to this morning responded that my notification was his response to my question of why I wasn't notified. So I need to call in to ask why I wasn't notified to get notification?
traveltrader,
The most I'd be able to offer in this case is to refer this post and your indication to our Tech Team, as it would not fall in line with any other parallel examples that we saw in real-time on the trade date. We show and our records imply that you would have been seeing in both Activity and Order Status a fill price that was substantially away from the market.
If you could message me with what fill price you did see, I will refer the details to Tech, though I suspect this may be difficult to recreate in a test environment. In cases where a fill price seems plausible, we do our best to notify clients as quickly as possible. In cases where there are clearly erroneous executions, we typically comply with the non-valid fill notification from the exchange without further notification to the client with the understanding that the fill that would have been showing would show clearly off the market.
Best, as always,
Rocco Sabino
TradeKing
Trading and Customer Support
The most I'd be able to offer in this case is to refer this post and your indication to our Tech Team, as it would not fall in line with any other parallel examples that we saw in real-time on the trade date. We show and our records imply that you would have been seeing in both Activity and Order Status a fill price that was substantially away from the market.
If you could message me with what fill price you did see, I will refer the details to Tech, though I suspect this may be difficult to recreate in a test environment. In cases where a fill price seems plausible, we do our best to notify clients as quickly as possible. In cases where there are clearly erroneous executions, we typically comply with the non-valid fill notification from the exchange without further notification to the client with the understanding that the fill that would have been showing would show clearly off the market.
Best, as always,
Rocco Sabino
TradeKing
Trading and Customer Support
Once again, thanks for your response. It is truly appreciated. I do find it troubling that it's TK policy to not notify their clients of reversed trades under certain situations. This only leads to confusion when a client wonders what happened to their shares.
There are glitches on the website. Quotes in particular have not worked properly for me in quite a while. I take the quotes I get on TK with a grain of salt. I guess I'll have to apply that same skepticism to the order executions as well. I have gotten into the habit of taking screenshots when things are blatantly wrong. In this case, that didn't seem to be the case. I guess the takeaway for me from this incident is to take screenshots regularly and double check all transactions on TK.
traveltrader,
If the market center reverses an execution you should receive an email from us as soon as we are informed. I will look into if this email was sent and if not why.
I'll pass your quote feedback to our tech team. All quotes are provided by a third party, if you are seeing problems let us know the positions its happening on so we can contact the data source and get it corrected. Screen shots of those are helpful.
As for the reversed execution, its a hard one to swallow however there is nothing we can do to honor the execution price when it is literally a small fraction of the actual price of the security. These things do happen once in a while at the market centers. I agree we should have communicated better to you on the reversal, as I mentioned I'll look into that part.
thanks,
Dave
If the market center reverses an execution you should receive an email from us as soon as we are informed. I will look into if this email was sent and if not why.
I'll pass your quote feedback to our tech team. All quotes are provided by a third party, if you are seeing problems let us know the positions its happening on so we can contact the data source and get it corrected. Screen shots of those are helpful.
As for the reversed execution, its a hard one to swallow however there is nothing we can do to honor the execution price when it is literally a small fraction of the actual price of the security. These things do happen once in a while at the market centers. I agree we should have communicated better to you on the reversal, as I mentioned I'll look into that part.
thanks,
Dave
tt, this wouldn't happen to be one of the Knight busted trades?
It wasn't. It happened the day after that incident. And was not one of the 6 stocks that was reversed.
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